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12:27 pm
October 13, 2011
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thethanx
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So after finding countless spellbooks, wands and heaters that don't do jack for me I got to thinking.
Considering the number of classes (monsters included) the odds of actually playing a class and finding a specific item for that class is getting pretty low, and dropping as more classes are introduced. Unless you ONLY play the major 3 classes.
Back when there was only a fairy wizard and crusader, you had a 50% 50% chance that if you found a specific item it would be for your class, but now there are 9 classes and more on the way… which means finding if you find a crusader only item, there's only an 11% chance you'll even be playing a crusader (assuming you play all classes about equally)
Therefore in a vast majority of games, class specific items are garbage, and few if none of them provide any real advantage when thrown.
However, I think class specific items are great, but I think something should be done to make them a little more useful to other classes.
After a lot of thinking and writing, rewriting and rerewriting this post I think that maybe my whole point boils down to this:
Class specific items are supposed to be better, but anyone who changes it up frequently will rarely find a good class specific item while playing that class. So make them useful regardless!
I think the easiest thing would be to make all class specific items do something SPECIAL when thrown.
Maybe a spellbook summons a lightning bolt that does a lot of magical (or godly) damage. A thrown tower shield could become a barrier that enemies must hack through to reach you, thrown plate could become a decoy that enemies have to attack…
You get the idea.
Still, this is my favorite game on the iOS
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2:28 pm
October 13, 2011
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WesPaugh
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There will only ever be 4-5 classes of class-specific items: Wizard, Crusader, Scoundrel, Monster and, maybe someday, Dinoman.
The new monster items (Flippable Comms Device, Monster Manual, Impractical Trinket, and Monster Juice), work the same for all monster classes, and their are no restrictions among them.
New monster-class specific items would provide similar levels of value to all monster classes equally. Monster Juice, for example, boosts damage output for all monsters classes one way or another; even the necromeister, who has no basic damaging attack, has improved damage for the few of his abilities that scale damage with max energy ( I believe death bolt does… or is it vampiric rain…?)
As long as I continue adding items to all four categories somewhat evenly, each game will give you the same probability for finding an item for the class you're playing. And, don't forget, you can always store items in the locker!
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1:58 pm
October 14, 2011
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m0rris0n
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I agree. As much as it annoys me to continually find items that aren't of use to the current character I'm playing there are ways to deal with it. I tend to stock the locker based on what I want to play next. For example, collect a bunch of spellbooks and then get the Fairy Wizard in to use them. I'm sure I'm not the only one to do this.
Having the monsters utilizing rings has been helpful. I still think there is more tweaking that could be done for equipping the monster classes but overall it's handled decently.
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7:32 pm
October 14, 2011
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thethanx
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Good to know that about monster juice… since it says it boosts strength I always figured it wouldn't do anything for them.
I guess I see what you mean… I guess maybe it's partially due to the fact that having beaten the game with the main characters I use them slightly less than the monster classes…
and when I think about it further, I realize that even if I GOT what I asked for all it would really do is make the game easier, which I'm not sure I really want anyway.
I think I'll be happy once the trinket and comm are functional. :)
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11:24 am
October 17, 2011
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m0rris0n
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Same here. It's frustrating that I could be doing more with the Monsters and I can't. Ah well. Hopefully next update.
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4:07 pm
October 19, 2011
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thethanx
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Wes, you said:
"As long as I continue adding items to all four categories somewhat evenly, each game will give you the same probability for finding an item for the class you're playing. And, don't forget, you can always store items in the locker!"
Than maybe you can explain the formula for how items are found then because what I see happening is this:
As more class specific items are added to the game, the chance of finding a class specific item will increase thereby decreasing the likelyhood of finding items that are useful to all classes.
Unless there's a more complex formula then this item has XX% chance of appearing…
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6:47 pm
October 19, 2011
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WesPaugh
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Post edited 6:48 pm – October 19, 2011 by WesPaugh
We use 6th grade probability. Seriously. In the code, I make a giant sack for marbles, and throw marbles of different colors in representing the possible items that can be made. The number of marbles each item gets to put into the sack has been generalized to the inverse of a 'rarity' value (we invert 'rarity' because it's easier for us to think of than just using a 'commonality' number. 'commonality' is such a dumb word'). Higher rarity means fewer marbles in the sack, lower rarity means more marbles.
So! Most, if not all, class-specific items are fairly rare in the first place. We keep the different rarities proportional to one another; adding more high rarity items to the game will automatically increase the number of marbles all low rarity items get, so no matter how many derivatives of the Sword of Some Awe or Axes of Greater Cludging we add to the game, rocks will always appear more commonly.
So that's the first part. Second, I'll admit that ultra-rare class-specific items do become somewhat more common to ultra-rare non-class-specific items as we add more class-specific ultra-rare items. So, I can mitigate *that* by just continuing to add more non-class-specific items. You'll just have to play longer to get any single item, statistically, but you'll continue getting a balanced spread of class-specific and non-class-specific items.
Finally, the odds that your class will be able to make use of a given item that drops will never be anything but 1 in 5, as long as I continue to add items evenly to all 5 categories at about the same rate.
Hope that clears some of this up.
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3:35 pm
October 20, 2011
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thethanx
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indeed it does clear things up. I guess it doesn't really help my strategy any to know how the math works on something random, but for some reason it makes me feel better to know how it all works.
Thanks!
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